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Section 3. Soon Kim presents her first major theme. She is somewhat depressed because she feels trapped in the role of traditional mother and housewife. (4:44 — 10:45). She feels resentful about having to report in a framework of patriarchy to her partner John, who seems to want to control her freedom. Specifically, he is jealous and distrustful when she spends time and money with her friends while he is out of town earning money for the family. The mutual distrust of the couple also could have its origins in the two unplanned pregnancies of their early relationship when she was on the Pill. The problem of role rigidity and the unsettled question of initiative within the relationship is partly addressed by Frank talking about how other couples handle this frequent dilemma (a normalizing reframe). They negotiate a 3-level system of total personal initiative (no reporting needed), partial freedom (informing the partner after the fact), and restriction (consultation must occur before the decision is made). Kim seems to respond quite favorably to this seemingly novel idea. The piece ends with the reframe that most men do not really want to demean their wives with controlling tactics; they just have not found an effective system to reassure them in their financial and relational insecurities. Kim resonates with this reframe, because she knows that when John questions her integrity, and she produces the data, that he does settle down. This is the third minor tilt in the direction of a solution focus in this interview.